Comments on: Numb and Number http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/ Home of Heart, Mind and Really Big Issues Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:24:07 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.5 by: ericr0283 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1477 Mon, 23 Apr 2007 00:58:32 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1477 twowheelfish says: "So the alternative is to restrict gun sales to the point that people simply can't obtain them" Is this goal realistic? Consider other widely used things that are illegal. Most illegal drugs represent a huge health risk to the user of those drugs (i.e. guns and most illegal drugs unquestionably have a great potential for great harm to someone). And so drugs are illegal, yet easily obtainable. Gambling is illegal, yet ubiquitious. Our prisons are full of non-violent drug users, and those prisoners are disproportionately non-white (and unfairly so, because the police focus drug enforcement on poor, non-white communities, while rich white drug users essentially get a pass). If simply possessing a gun became illegal, who would be more likely to go to prison for simple gun possession- a minority in Salt Lake City or some white dude in Sandy? If guns became illegal, rest assured there would be many more mere gun possessors in prison than those that used guns in the commission of another crime. Do we really need more people in prison in our society? Do we want to give the government, the police and the district attorneys more laws to subjectively enforce, more reasons to put a person who's done no actual harm to anyone in prison? Virginia Tech is an unspeakable tragedy. But with 300 million people and a (mostly) free society, can we prevent all the tragedies? Are more laws and restrictions always the answer? More more reasoning along these lines, please go to: http://web.mac.com/ericr0283 twowheelfish says: “So the alternative is to restrict gun sales to the point that people simply can’t obtain them” Is this goal realistic? Consider other widely used things that are illegal. Most illegal drugs represent a huge health risk to the user of those drugs (i.e. guns and most illegal drugs unquestionably have a great potential for great harm to someone). And so drugs are illegal, yet easily obtainable. Gambling is illegal, yet ubiquitious. Our prisons are full of non-violent drug users, and those prisoners are disproportionately non-white (and unfairly so, because the police focus drug enforcement on poor, non-white communities, while rich white drug users essentially get a pass). If simply possessing a gun became illegal, who would be more likely to go to prison for simple gun possession- a minority in Salt Lake City or some white dude in Sandy? If guns became illegal, rest assured there would be many more mere gun possessors in prison than those that used guns in the commission of another crime. Do we really need more people in prison in our society? Do we want to give the government, the police and the district attorneys more laws to subjectively enforce, more reasons to put a person who’s done no actual harm to anyone in prison? Virginia Tech is an unspeakable tragedy. But with 300 million people and a (mostly) free society, can we prevent all the tragedies? Are more laws and restrictions always the answer?

More more reasoning along these lines, please go to: http://web.mac.com/ericr0283

]]> by: debi http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1457 Thu, 19 Apr 2007 13:54:07 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1457 "...a murmur in the wind.." Ted, you're so sweet. I'd say more like a fart. Re: VATech. Everyone who has ever loved a child grieves for the lost dreams. “…a murmur in the wind..” Ted, you’re so sweet. I’d say more like a fart.

Re: VATech. Everyone who has ever loved a child grieves for the lost dreams.

]]> by: twowheelfish http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1454 Thu, 19 Apr 2007 03:33:40 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1454 I dunno H, are the gun control arguments really old? We have, in this country, had virtually unrestricted access to guns since the republic was founded. The gun controls that exist have no guts or backbone and frankly don't do a damn thing. In Virginia, you can walk out with your pistol and hollow points once the VISA charge clears. The goal of gun rights advocates is to saturate every site in human society with concealed haadguns with the hope that when a crazy dude sets on a crowd, someone will take HIM out. But that goal is myopic and unrealistic: it won't happen. So the alternative is to restrict gun sales to the point that people simply can't obtain them. I would much rather live in a society where a crazy guy takes on a crowd in a shopping mall or classroom at a university with a sharp knife rather than a 9mm. Maybe Rocky could ban gun sales in SLC before he leaves office. Might as well go out with a BANG! I dunno H, are the gun control arguments really old?
We have, in this country, had virtually unrestricted access to guns since the republic was founded. The gun controls that exist have no guts or backbone and frankly don’t do a damn thing. In Virginia, you can walk out with your pistol and hollow points once the VISA charge clears.
The goal of gun rights advocates is to saturate every site in human society with concealed haadguns with the hope that when a crazy dude sets on a crowd, someone will take HIM out. But that goal is myopic and unrealistic: it won’t happen.
So the alternative is to restrict gun sales to the point that people simply can’t obtain them. I would much rather live in a society where a crazy guy takes on a crowd in a shopping mall or classroom at a university with a sharp knife rather than a 9mm.
Maybe Rocky could ban gun sales in SLC before he leaves office. Might as well go out with a BANG!

]]> by: redtazz http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1453 Thu, 19 Apr 2007 00:18:47 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1453 NOTE to ttstark, I hope that you take the time to read this. I suggest you get to know more about Holly before slamming her. She is a good journalist and a great human being. Holly is an exceptional writer who can eloquently describe the emotions that many people experience in tragic circumstances. Holly was the only bright spot in my life on January 3, 2005. This day, my dear friend Theresa Marie Fuentes Harris was murdered in front of her children, and then her ex-husband turned the gun on himself, leaving all four of their children as orphans. Holly has devoted much of her time to domestic violence and is a strong advocate to ALL women who find themselves as victims. I hope that it is ok to do this (regarding copyright laws), but I am including an article that Holly wrote on 1/9/07. It was published in The Salt Lake Tribune. I called Holly and told her the story. She came to Theresa's funeral and wrote this wonderful tribute. This article meant so much to all of us that love Theresa and were seriously grieving at how she lost her life. Mullen: Divorce can give a way out Holly Mullen Salt Lake Tribune Columnist Salt Lake Tribune Published January 9, 2005 Annamarie Bloch and Theresa Harris shared passions that only a couple of sisters could appreciate. Top of the list: They each had a thing for Mel Gibson. "We had this thing going for him since we were kids," Bloch said. So, on a day eight years ago, when Bloch awoke woozy after 13 hours of surgery for breast cancer, the first image she saw was none other than Gibson. Taped to the wall of her hospital room was a 7-foot-high promotional poster of the actor in "Braveheart." Mel was wearing a kilt. "Theresa had gone to every video store in the area - it was the week that 'Braveheart' had come out on video," said Bloch. "She pestered the clerk until he just said, 'Here, take it while I look the other way.' " Similar stories rolled out for two hours during a Friday funeral service at the Hunter 4th LDS Ward in West Valley City. Friends, relatives and church leaders regaled a packed chapel with memories of a woman who loved to laugh, cooked any recipe she could find and spent her vacations distributing care packages to orphans in Brazil. What a scene it was - people laughing out loud one second and dabbing at their tear-filled eyes the next. Harris, 43, died on Jan. 2 at the hands of her ex-husband, Hector Leiva-Fuentes. She had stopped at Leiva-Fuentes' home to drop off groceries for their 17-year-old son, who was sick in bed. Leiva-Fuentes - whom police confirmed had threatened to kill his ex-wife in a phone call last summer - confronted her in the driveway, shot her to death and then turned the gun on himself. To compound the tragedy, the act was witnessed by two of the couple's daughters, ages 12 and 9. A 14-year-old daughter was elsewhere at the time. Theresa also left behind her husband of only 12 days, Bradley Harris, whom funeral speakers described as "the love of her life." Listening to those eulogies, I couldn't help but consider the irony of a woman who gave of herself endlessly in trips to those Brazilian orphanages - now her children are grieving the deaths of their own parents. Elizabeth Sollis, a spokeswoman for the state Division of Family Services, said the children remain in foster care while authorities work toward a kinship placement. And I wondered, too, how much good a state legislator means to do with a bill this year to eliminate most no-fault divorces in Utah. Rep. Peggy Wallace, R-West Jordan, told The Tribune last month "there should be some shame" in getting a divorce. Wallace believes it's just too easy for people - especially those with young children - to ditch their marriages. I wish Wallace had been at this funeral. Someone might have told her of the shame an abused woman lives with every day - undeserved that it is. Harris fit that profile. Jan Smith LaBard, a friend who worked with Harris at a Salt Lake County call center from 2000 to 2003, contacted me a few days after the murder. "Theresa always told me, 'He's going to kill me, he's going to hurt the kids.' She had friends who offered to put her up, but she was afraid to leave. I lost touch with her a couple of years ago, and now this." At some point, Harris did, at last, extricate herself from the violence. She had moved out, divorced Leiva-Fuentes and obtained a protective order. Utah's no-fault divorce law let her escape without giving a reason. A little less shame for a woman who knew that emotion all too well. hmullen@sltrib.com NOTE to ttstark, I hope that you take the time to read this. I suggest you get to know more about Holly before slamming her. She is a good journalist and a great human being. Holly is an exceptional writer who can eloquently describe the emotions that many people experience in tragic circumstances.

Holly was the only bright spot in my life on January 3, 2005. This day, my dear friend Theresa Marie Fuentes Harris was murdered in front of her children, and then her ex-husband turned the gun on himself, leaving all four of their children as orphans. Holly has devoted much of her time to domestic violence and is a strong advocate to ALL women who find themselves as victims.

I hope that it is ok to do this (regarding copyright laws), but I am including an article that Holly wrote on 1/9/07. It was published in The Salt Lake Tribune. I called Holly and told her the story. She came to Theresa’s funeral and wrote this wonderful tribute. This article meant so much to all of us that love Theresa and were seriously grieving at how she lost her life.

Mullen: Divorce can give a way out

Holly Mullen
Salt Lake Tribune Columnist
Salt Lake Tribune
Published January 9, 2005

Annamarie Bloch and Theresa Harris shared passions that only a couple of sisters could appreciate. Top of the list: They each had a thing for Mel Gibson.
“We had this thing going for him since we were kids,” Bloch said. So, on a day eight years ago, when Bloch awoke woozy after 13 hours of surgery for breast cancer, the first image she saw was none other than Gibson. Taped to the wall of her hospital room was a 7-foot-high promotional poster of the actor in “Braveheart.” Mel was wearing a kilt.
“Theresa had gone to every video store in the area - it was the week that ‘Braveheart’ had come out on video,” said Bloch. “She pestered the clerk until he just said, ‘Here, take it while I look the other way.’ ”
Similar stories rolled out for two hours during a Friday funeral service at the Hunter 4th LDS Ward in West Valley City. Friends, relatives and church leaders regaled a packed chapel with memories of a woman who loved to laugh, cooked any recipe she could find and spent her vacations distributing care packages to orphans in Brazil. What a scene it was - people laughing out loud one second and dabbing at their tear-filled eyes the next.
Harris, 43, died on Jan. 2 at the hands of her ex-husband, Hector Leiva-Fuentes. She had stopped at Leiva-Fuentes’ home to drop off groceries for their 17-year-old son, who was sick in bed. Leiva-Fuentes - whom police confirmed had threatened to kill his ex-wife in a phone call last summer - confronted her in the driveway, shot her to death and then turned the gun on himself. To compound the tragedy, the act was witnessed by two of the couple’s daughters, ages 12 and 9. A 14-year-old daughter was elsewhere at the time. Theresa also left behind her husband of only 12 days, Bradley Harris, whom funeral speakers described as “the love of her life.”
Listening to those eulogies, I couldn’t help but consider the irony of a woman who gave of herself endlessly in trips to those Brazilian orphanages - now her children are grieving the deaths of their own parents. Elizabeth Sollis, a spokeswoman for the state Division of Family Services, said the children remain in foster care while authorities work toward a kinship placement.
And I wondered, too, how much good a state legislator means to do with a bill this year to eliminate most no-fault divorces in Utah. Rep. Peggy Wallace, R-West Jordan, told The Tribune last month “there should be some shame” in getting a divorce. Wallace believes it’s just too easy for people - especially those with young children - to ditch their marriages.
I wish Wallace had been at this funeral. Someone might have told her of the shame an abused woman lives with every day - undeserved that it is. Harris fit that profile. Jan Smith LaBard, a friend who worked with Harris at a Salt Lake County call center from 2000 to 2003, contacted me a few days after the murder. “Theresa always told me, ‘He’s going to kill me, he’s going to hurt the kids.’ She had friends who offered to put her up, but she was afraid to leave. I lost touch with her a couple of years ago, and now this.”
At some point, Harris did, at last, extricate herself from the violence. She had moved out, divorced Leiva-Fuentes and obtained a protective order. Utah’s no-fault divorce law let her escape without giving a reason. A little less shame for a woman who knew that emotion all too well.
hmullen@sltrib.com

]]> by: dougwe http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1452 Wed, 18 Apr 2007 23:14:28 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1452 I think I see ttstark's agenda clearly, as it's pretty much the same one found around Fox and other right-tilted media. If you can't rationally and intelligently argue the message, personally attack the messenger. Volume and vitriol always play well to those who can't or won't hold a position based on reason rather than emotional rhetoric. I'm shocked he(she) didn't question Holly's patriotism, or claim that she gives aid and comfort to terrorists as well. That usually accompanies every personal attack, doesn't it? Holly, you have to take encouragement in this, though. Your blog isn't just being read by like minded-spirits. The deluded may not like your message, but you wouldn't be hearing from them if they weren't reading your work! I think I see ttstark’s agenda clearly, as it’s pretty much the same one found around Fox and other right-tilted media. If you can’t rationally and intelligently argue the message, personally attack the messenger. Volume and vitriol always play well to those who can’t or won’t hold a position based on reason rather than emotional rhetoric. I’m shocked he(she) didn’t question Holly’s patriotism, or claim that she gives aid and comfort to terrorists as well. That usually accompanies every personal attack, doesn’t it?

Holly, you have to take encouragement in this, though. Your blog isn’t just being read by like minded-spirits. The deluded may not like your message, but you wouldn’t be hearing from them if they weren’t reading your work!

]]> by: Nic http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1451 Wed, 18 Apr 2007 11:28:35 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1451 ttstark, Ted was way too kind in 1)Addressing you as "Dear" and calling you a 2)"murmur in the wind." I'm not sure what your reasons or motives are for atacking the messanger. You sound as if you need anger management classes. Three words for you:GET A LIFE! Or a therapist. Holly was the only reason I looked forward to reading The Salt Lake Tribune. I still read it and enjoy reading Rebecca and Rolly. But alas, the joy of opening the Trib and seeing her byline is long gone. ttstark,
Ted was way too kind in 1)Addressing you as “Dear” and calling you a 2)”murmur in the wind.”
I’m not sure what your reasons or motives are for atacking the messanger.
You sound as if you need anger management classes.
Three words for you:GET A LIFE! Or a therapist.
Holly was the only reason I looked forward to reading The Salt Lake Tribune. I still read it and enjoy reading Rebecca and Rolly. But alas, the joy of opening the Trib and seeing her byline is long gone.

]]> by: Oregon pinot noir http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1450 Wed, 18 Apr 2007 01:40:43 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1450 I wonder what ttstark's agenda is really about? It seems pointless and lashing out at the wind. I too question his/her crediblity as a reporter and/or journalist. It sounds like projection to me.... an overused defense mechanism at best...at worst a veiled attack about something having little to do with this blog. I wonder what ttstark’s agenda is really about? It seems pointless and lashing out at the wind. I too question his/her crediblity as a reporter and/or journalist. It sounds like projection to me…. an overused defense mechanism at best…at worst a veiled attack about something having little to do with this blog.

]]> by: UofUman http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1449 Wed, 18 Apr 2007 00:38:40 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1449 Ditto on the dumb timing, ttstark. Try to stay on topic and save the unrelated flames for other times. Enough of that though. Numbness about the VT shooting is all I feel right now. Another 33 lives lost due to some other poor soul losing touch with the world the rest of us reside in. I have no ideas, I can't identify with the various strident voices calling for their point of view, 'More Gun Control', 'Less Gun Control', 'Less Violence on TV', etc, etc, etc. I just can't get behind any of this because I see and don't see value in all of it. I guess all I can think is that somehow this poor sad soul ended up in the dark place all by himself and could only see insane violence as the answer. And 30 some odd innocent students and teachers pay the price of his journey into the dark. I can only see sadness and regret for all parties. Blame will have to come later for me. Peace to all. Ditto on the dumb timing, ttstark. Try to stay on topic and save the unrelated flames for other times. Enough of that though.

Numbness about the VT shooting is all I feel right now. Another 33 lives lost due to some other poor soul losing touch with the world the rest of us reside in. I have no ideas, I can’t identify with the various strident voices calling for their point of view, ‘More Gun Control’, ‘Less Gun Control’, ‘Less Violence on TV’, etc, etc, etc.

I just can’t get behind any of this because I see and don’t see value in all of it. I guess all I can think is that somehow this poor sad soul ended up in the dark place all by himself and could only see insane violence as the answer. And 30 some odd innocent students and teachers pay the price of his journey into the dark. I can only see sadness and regret for all parties. Blame will have to come later for me.

Peace to all.

]]> by: tedwilson http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1446 Tue, 17 Apr 2007 23:19:50 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1446 Dear ttstark, Any guts? If so, you'll leave a real name. Otherwise, you're a murmur in the wind. That's a tough place for a reporter - if you really are one. Husband Ted Dear ttstark,

Any guts? If so, you’ll leave a real name. Otherwise, you’re a murmur in the wind. That’s a tough place for a reporter - if you really are one.

Husband Ted

]]> by: spencert http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1445 Tue, 17 Apr 2007 22:49:28 +0000 http://mullentown.com/numb-and-number/#comment-1445 I am also more than a little miffed at ttstark's comments. The trib is in a much sadder state since Holly's departure and the City Weekly can only benefit from her experience and bring it back to the cool little local paper it was back in the Private Eye days. So to ttstark I say welcome and don't let the door hit your ass on the way out. As for the tragedy in Virginia, my heart just aches for the souls lost in such a sensless act of violence. We will all grieve and then search for understanding, but like Columbine, Trolley Square, etc... we may never truly understand what drives a certain few to such horrific acts. I will still continue to give humankind the benefit of the doubt and hope that someday we may evolve beyond this insanity. Cheers! I am also more than a little miffed at ttstark’s comments. The trib is in a much sadder state since Holly’s departure and the City Weekly can only benefit from her experience and bring it back to the cool little local paper it was back in the Private Eye days. So to ttstark I say welcome and don’t let the door hit your ass on the way out.

As for the tragedy in Virginia, my heart just aches for the souls lost in such a sensless act of violence. We will all grieve and then search for understanding, but like Columbine, Trolley Square, etc… we may never truly understand what drives a certain few to such horrific acts. I will still continue to give humankind the benefit of the doubt and hope that someday we may evolve beyond this insanity.

Cheers!

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